Episode 6

February 10, 2022

00:28:10

Its Just a Scam! (Joyce Petrowski)

Hosted by

Tony Siebers
Its Just a Scam! (Joyce Petrowski)
Parent Projects
Its Just a Scam! (Joyce Petrowski)
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Episode Transcript

Speaker 0 00:00:00 You're listening to senior moves. Speaker 1 00:00:03 Welcome to this Thursday's release of the podcast, where we're talking about ways to manage the impacts of distance and apparent project. And specifically this week at senior moves, we've been focused on empowering advocates to recognize, to communicate and respond to scams with a series of articles and content that have been cultivated for our members. Today, I'm joined by Joyce Petroski. She's the founder and executive director of the Arizona not-for-profit resources and outreach to safeguard the elderly. Yup. That's an acronym. It's also known as rose. Joyce was a public accountant by trade and an avid volunteer and philanthropist by her calling, which brought her into the nonprofit sector in about 2014. And when she recognized the need for public education around financial scams, especially those that were targeting the elderly, she jumped all in today. She leads a team who share her calling and together they're on this mission and they're going to prevent the financial exploitation and the defrauding of the elderly through their advocacy in their education programs. Speaker 1 00:01:01 We're going to be discussing efforts to help you increase awareness of the current scams going on how to respond if they strike your loved one and how to arm you with some tools and some resources you might be able to share with some friends and family members as always listen for our incorporated articles from parent projects, magazine hosted over [email protected] resources that have been curated to empower you and your family to dig yet. Overall, there's some great information on how to handle and respond when it's just a scam. So I hope you guys enjoy the content today. Speaker 0 00:01:42 You're listening to parent projects, a senior moves podcast production. Now here's your host, Tony CBRE's Speaker 3 00:01:52 And welcome. Yeah. Joyce, thank you very much for joining the Speaker 4 00:01:56 Nest. Well thank you for having me Speaker 3 00:01:58 Well, we've, we've got a lot of great stuff throughout this whole week. Back through senior moves, we've been really focused on that distance, as we said, uh, one of the core things that really rocks everybody is dealing with, uh, the scam or someone taking advantage of mom and dad, or you're at age 11. Even if it's a friend that you're working as an advocate for, uh, and the helplessness, the frustration of it, the not, not being there, that, that you didn't catch it, but the reality is not only do you have to be aware of stuff, you gotta respond to it. And you guys seem to focus on that with a really unique way in educating people about why it's happening in the first place. What tell us about rose, tell us about what you're really going for there. Speaker 4 00:02:40 So, uh, thank you, Tony. Um, so rose was, uh, started to bring edgy, bring awareness to specifically the elderly population, because they're one of the top vulnerable populations, uh, when it comes to the number of victims in the amount of monetary loss. Um, so bring awareness about the different financial scams that are out there, uh, that typically target them and then educate them through how the scam works, why the scammer is talking to them the way they're talking to them. Um, and then also giving them tips and tools on how to prevent becoming a victim. Cause it's not a matter of if they're going to get that phone call, email text, it's a matter of when and it can happen multiple times. And so we truly believe that the more we can stay in front of people and keep talking about it, the more it's going to become a habit and second nature for them to know what to do to not fall victim. Speaker 3 00:03:42 That's fantastic. And you know, is, is those that are familiar with the show. Know, we like to really focus the show on our, our call to action of moving you from point a to point B and those point a that we think you're at. And the point B is we're really looking to speak. If, if you are someone who a scam has hit, you've got to respond to it, or you just feel it's eminent given your situation and what's happening. Uh, and you don't know how to communicate about that. The point B we want to get you to is to know how to at, at the back end of this is to know how to be aware of, of, uh, of what to recognize and to see, and those signs to have the dignity, um, to have this dignity focused conversation points and good talking points, to know how to communicate with your age loved one. Speaker 3 00:04:28 And then we want to leave you with some resources and tools that will help you process and work through it. So Joyce let's, let's just jump right into that. Okay. As always, we have, uh, multiple articles, uh, in the parent projects, uh, magazine, that's hosted over at flip boards that you can follow along that really work in with, with managing distance specific to these topics. We have, uh, two articles to that. We'll talk about, you know, here's kind of come in and out with, uh, throughout the course of today. Uh, the first is the five ways to prevent elder financial exploitation, uh, and that, uh, both of them are ARP apt. So happens our ARP articles for this week. Uh, that's John Rosengren, uh, the second one that we'll talk through Nancy, um, um, Lamond talks about an iceberg of unseen crime, urgent action needed on consumer fraud and, and really that call to action there, which is something that motivated us to get into the podcast. So, uh, with that, let's, let's dive into awareness. So what, what what's out there today, what do you guys see in, in the cybersecurity side of the house and, and what should families and advocates be aware of? Speaker 4 00:05:38 Well, um, you know, the scams and frauds have been around for years and years, and especially with the last two years with COVID and more people shopping online, being online, they're home by themselves, especially the elderly. If they live by themselves, there, they get very lonely because they're not able to go and meet people. So when someone befriends them on an online game or through social media, um, there's that much more chance that they might carry on and engage in the conversations. Um, so, and, and that the scammers are becoming more creative, you know, every day they're finding new ways to do things. Um, and so, you know, it's, it runs the gamut. You know, there's going to be phishing emails that come through that are going to try to get you, you know, to click on a link. Um, you might be sitting on your computer and all of a sudden a pop-up comes up and starts splashing that something's wrong with your computer. Speaker 4 00:06:40 You have a virus, you need to click here. We can help you, you know, that's a scam as well. Um, but it puts a panic in you like, oh my gosh, my computer's broke. I need to do this. Um, you know, there's the, the, uh, romance scams, you know, where they're going to be friends you on social media, on the online games, um, and establish a relationship with you. A lot of times they're gonna, they're gonna mimic kind of what you have going on. Um, but evidently on all of them in the, in the end, they're going to ask you for money and when you have no more money to give them, they're going to move on to somebody else. Um, and then go ahead. I'm sorry. Speaker 3 00:07:21 No, I was just going to say, you know, in all of those, what it will really strikes me, especially when you talk about how this is going to happen, it's a matter of time, right? It seems like it used to be maybe in earlier versions of the internet, you just avoided certain areas and you are going to be able to stay out of this stuff. Right. But now they are going to places that are good and healthy and we're, we're, we're expecting, and we're encouraging our loved ones to make use of, and we're trying to get them into those things and this what a frustration and how they can, they can undermine those efforts in, in general. So, um, the, yeah, the romance schemes off of that as well. Um, and I've heard of them being sophisticated enough where they'll pull all different social media. Speaker 3 00:08:08 I mean, they'll, they'll know more about the target than the target realizes and definitely more than they know about the other person. Um, so, so maybe being aware, I know as a former police officer being aware, when you get into a conversation with someone where they're there, they seem much more aware of who you are and other information than you do about them is usually a good reason to take pause for a second and make sure you understand that relationship and how it's beginning, that's on equal footing. I tell you if that's got some level of, uh, of a digital or virtual, uh, fingerprint here in what you're talking about. Right, Speaker 4 00:08:45 Right. Um, and you're exactly right. You can learn a lot about someone on their social media. And so, you know, that's why you see a lot of times on social media, random people asking those questions, you know, um, about your pets, about the first concert you attended about this, your car, about, you know, that not only gets them into security answers on your security questions. Um, it also, um, you know, uh, teaches them more about you and your background. And a lot of people, you know, I think social media started so long distance family members can have a better relationship and they can see pictures and, and, and talk to, you know, people and, and, and key and keep in touch that way. Um, and unfortunately scammers are using it, using it against us. Yeah. Speaker 3 00:09:40 Yeah. And, and really it for us, especially senior moves that encouraged us to start developing privacy, first applications, our tools, you know, obviously what we're working with in the, in the, in our apps and development and senior moves, connect app, giving outlets in places where people can communicate, I'm not going to throw the shameless plugin for where that's going to go, but I just, it drives it home. It's, it's, it's top of mind for us too. That's fantastic. Well, okay. So it, so it happens, so you're aware of it, you know, things are happening. Um, you got to, I guess there might be a couple of ways to communicate. And the first is, let's say you just became aware of it. A family member, you know, jumped into a taxi, uh, and dropped off a package for $5,000, $8,000. Um, how do you respond as a family member? Speaker 4 00:10:36 Um, that's a really good question. Um, I had a loved one, uh, years back that was in, uh, was a victim to a scam. And my first reaction was I was angry and I think that's an upset. I was, you know, I wasn't angry at my loved one. I was angry that it happened and angry at the person that was doing it. But, and I think a lot of family members that might be their first reaction, but we need to step back and be aware of that and understand that this can happen to anybody. You know, kids can get scammed, young adults get scammed, teenagers. Middle-aged all the, the, the whole gamut, you know, can, everybody can get scammed. And so I think if we start having those conversations with our, uh, loved ones or, um, family and friends, especially in the elderly population, um, start having the conversations about scams and about different techniques, um, to, you know, to help prevent them falling victim the scan and keep having those conversations and just make it a regular conversation. Speaker 4 00:12:00 So if the time comes that they have engaged in a conversation with a scam or they've clicked on a link, um, I think there'll be more apt to talk to you about it. And they won't because you've already opened up the line of communication with them and you discuss things with them. And especially just saying, if you ever make a mistake and you click on a link, or if you've engaged in conversation with someone through social media that you don't know, just talk to me about it, I'm here, you know, I'm here to help. And just, you know, in the back of your mind, you know, you could be still a little angry or whatever, but what you need to present to the person is just dignity understanding and okay, this happened, what are, what can we do to stop it? And what can we do to prevent it in the future and just be helpful, sincere, and calm. And, um, you know, I think it'll do wonders to help them want to continue to have conversations with you about it, and it's going to help them learn Speaker 3 00:13:11 Well. And, and that is, and if you can be seen as the person who's informed that can teach them at the pace they want and help them to understand not just what happened to them in this particular one, but why, why it happened and how they could get in front of it. It does come down to, especially as we age, there are things we, we start losing control of this. Doesn't have to be one of them, right. Becoming, uh, th th this is one that if someone can help us gain more control by understanding advocates, that would just benefit them. So, yeah, I do love that. The, the other I really liked too. And what you said, uh, fear and guilt, fear, and guilt, um, can shut stuff down and exactly Jim generally, right. Guilt, guilt to avoid something awesome guilt after something that's not right. That's not a, not a God. That's not a good thing for us that doesn't do a lot thinking to, uh, proactively that it's not how it's not what your intent is at that point in time. You have to constantly check in to know how you're being received, right. Speaker 4 00:14:22 And, Speaker 3 00:14:22 Uh, because they, they may have guilt just because it happened to them while they're in that process of dealing with it. And, uh, the tone of voice, or, or too much information at them at that one time, maybe what sparks an unintended consequence in the conversation. Speaker 4 00:14:37 So I totally agree, Speaker 3 00:14:40 You know, re reading that can go a long way. I love that pace of conversation, avoiding fear, fear, and guilt, really being aware and checking in with our own emotions. Awesome. Awesome touch points to set you in a good conversation. Yeah. Let's transition if we could into, uh, some tools and resources. Sure, man, alive, do these things keep evolving and changing. I think that the latest one I'm seeing, uh, and when they come, they, you know, get one, two, and then 50 of them. It's amazing. I think now, uh, Norton antivirus is emailing me 50 times a day to tell me that my $700 subscription, don't worry. It's good. My credit card worked. Right. So, um, the, those it's, that's fascinating to see those, what, uh, what are some tools and resources that we can use to keep up on what what's coming. Speaker 4 00:15:35 So, um, you know, with the th these are going to be some basic tools and resources. Uh, so especially with the elderly, if they're not going to need any more credit freeze your credit, and that's going to help any future credit being taken out in your name. Speaker 3 00:15:57 Well, we even, you know, uh, we freeze ours, my wife and I freeze our credit. And anytime, you know, you show up at, somebody goes to hit it and you get this alert to it, and then you just have to unlock it. It's as simple, actually these days, it's pretty easy to do. So Speaker 4 00:16:15 You have to remember your password that you use to freeze it, because you'll need that when you need to unfreeze it, but it's free, you know, um, there's also a credit monitoring and alerts that you can put on your accounts. You can put, uh, credit monitoring and alerts on with the FTC. Um, they explained that along with the credit freezes, the, uh, federal trade commission, it's ftc.gov. They have all the information in there on how you can do it. Um, and there are specific, uh, credit alerts and monitoring specifically for veterans. Uh, it's on the FTCs website. You can find that out, um, you know, order a copy of your credit report and make sure that everything's on there is legit. And, you know, as Speaker 3 00:17:00 That's an annual thing people can do, right? Speaker 4 00:17:04 Yeah. You can get it for free, right. And, um, uh, having, uh, your computer, uh, if you're using a laptop, an iPad, a desktop, a good antivirus software is a must because that software, you need to make sure you have it turned on because you need to make sure it stays up to date. So when there's updates, you need to update it. That's going to be working in the background and that will prevent it. It very well can prevent a malicious attack on your computer. It can make you aware of it. Um, and, um, so that can, you can use that for that, the computers, but then also passwords, um, for your accounts still to this day, a lot of people use password 1, 2, 3, or the name of their dog, and then their birth date, or one of their kids' names, you know, and the year they got married and all of that stuff can be found on social media. Speaker 4 00:18:09 And so, and, and they use the past the same password for every account. You really need to have a strong password, different password for each account. It needs to be at least 10 characters. You need to use upper and lowercase letters, numbers, and special characters. And so what some people have said really works for them is they have a phrase that they know, and they take the phrase and they take some of the letters and make them lowercase, uppercase. They take some of them and switch them to numbers. They take some of them and switch them to special characters. Um, you know, but then also getting into a password manager. That's a way that will hold all of your passwords. So you only have to remember one, which is a great tool, but I understand with the elderly that's might not be something they want to get into. So you really would need the advocate to kind of work through it with them, to set it up and work through it with them and make sure that they understand how it works and you know how to get into it, to get that password. Um, Speaker 3 00:19:16 Well, you know, I'll link back on that path by far password keepers, antivirus software, both required to be kept up from difficult, that that can be problematic. The reality is they're truly important when it comes down to this. And so what I might throw in would be when, when we talked previously in other episodes, uh, in, in technology, for instance, one of the recommendations was, uh, make sure that the, your, uh, the age loved one that you're working for advocating for put them on the same platform you use. If you use a Mac, put them on a Mac, if they're on a PC that op works with windows eight or windows seven, like put them on that, use the same programs so that you can, you can talk them through the interface. If you need to also, you'll find that if, if your antivirus software comes up in a task and for refresh, chances are there's is two, Speaker 4 00:20:09 That's a great point, have them on the same account, as, you know, as you, because then you can track. And if they say, Hey, I'm getting a notice that my antivirus software needs to be updated. They want me to pay $700. You could say, no, it's paid through this this day. You don't need to do anything. So that's, that's a great example. And, and having them on the same platform is great because I use a PC, my husband uses a Mac, and if I had to try to tell somebody how to navigate on a Mac through something, I couldn't do it. So that's awesome. That's awesome information, Speaker 3 00:20:44 You know, the other, the other thing, um, that, uh, that can kind of help from a technology standpoint, uh, when you're, when you're selecting the technologies today, look through it, look your ARP, look through caregiving, coalitions, look for those things to find those rules and resources, really with the movement we see as a movement of baby boomers and to the senior population, they just demand of it as a generation that, that this work better for them. Um, and the market response. I mean, I think I heard once that they, they hold 38% or just under 40% of the wealth, but they control 70 over 70% of spending. So if, uh, so if they ask for it, the market will respond to we'll Speaker 4 00:21:34 Start. Yeah. I think we'll Speaker 3 00:21:36 Start seeing some of those, Speaker 4 00:21:38 Right. So I, I agree. ARP has a lot of good resources for different things. The federal trade commission, ftc.gov has a lot of great resources. We are going to be posting on our website, rose advocacy.org. Next early, next week, we are going to have a more detailed information on how to freeze your credit, how to put credit monitoring in place anti-virus software. And it it'll link to articles that have compared 10 or 15 different anti-virus softwares and give you the pros and cons. So you can then look at it and determine which works best for you. Um, you know, the same thing with, um, uh, uh, passwords is, uh, passwords. These days are not enough anymore. What used to be enough years ago to secure your account is not enough anymore. And a really good added layer to that is multifactor or two factor authentication. Speaker 4 00:22:35 And most accounts will allow you to do that. And if you don't have it on those accounts, you just need to get into the settings. And somewhere in the settings, it'll ask you, you can turn it on. And then every time you log into that account, it'll text you a code, or you could use the authenticator app, which then you'd have to work through that app on how that works. But if you're getting the code texted to you, that's great. But you need to understand that scammers realize that, and they can pretend to be a legitimate business that you work with, but it's really them. And they can, they can authorize the, the, the code to come to you. And they're going to be like, all right, you're going to get a text with a code. I need to have it. So you need to understand that you don't give that code to anybody it's yours locked down. Nobody can have that code. So, Speaker 3 00:23:32 You know, that, that is, I think in the, uh, in the article, in the Rosengren article, uh, of the recommendations that, that he was making, um, and having that financial power of attorney and some other things, one of one that I really liked, I think it was the third one that he, that he worked through was using services that track bank accounts, investments, and credit cards, all in one place. I don't know if you're familiar with the mint platform, or if you've seen mint, Intuit makes it, Speaker 4 00:24:01 I've heard of it, but I have not dove into it yet. Speaker 3 00:24:04 We we've had some that I'd be curious at other times, so I will put it on the spot then for here, but that, that platform, everything connects into one place. So you don't have to go check in with every IRA and every bank account, and to see all of that, everything sits in one clean area. It uses multi-factor authentication the one-time you get into it. But, um, what has been really great is in particular situations where maybe you're trying to gain trust of a family member to help them with finance, or you want to be able to see that $10,000 that went out of the bank. And maybe you're not from Wichita, Kansas, where the bank picks up the phone and calls you and says, your mom just left with a $10,000 check. Right. Right. Um, cause that's happens in great places and good on them. Speaker 3 00:24:50 Um, but these days today, this can give you that awareness without giving you the detail or the control, they control their money, everything sits back there, but you can set alerts up to see when that kind of activity is happening or, or, and honestly it connects you to credit reports and other things. So, um, as you, as multi-factor authentication that you're suggesting, I think gets, um, as is it becomes a standard and the norm, if a family members moving into age where that's hard, uh, that might be a good solution, starting to look at something like that, a solution at the next time. Speaker 4 00:25:24 Yeah. I'm definitely going to look into that more. Um, you know, another thing is like, especially on bank accounts, investments, retirement accounts is have a trusted individual and that could be a friend or a family member have a trusted individual on that account with you, because then if somebody from the, uh, brokerage firm or the bank starts to see some really unusual activity, um, they can talk to that trusted person as well, that could help put a stop to, you know, what whatever is going on. Speaker 3 00:26:03 Yeah. That's fantastic. And that couldn't be just making the fiduciary responsibility is what, you know, when we've interviewed or talk with attorneys and they've talked to us about that, the fiduciary that can help. And sometimes it's in the case of our family. I know specifically our parents had added us on into the bank accounts to be able to see that and to help, uh, just to cover down. Yeah. Right. Um, well that is fantastic. Love that, uh, you have, uh, tips, interests and resources, obviously, uh, out to the website, uh, your rose, your rose website, that's rose advocacy.org, right? You guys are doing fantastic things. Joyce, I can't tell you how much I appreciate you coming on and helping our members get from point a to point B on this and understand some ways to talk through and work with their loved ones and their age as they advocate for them. Thank you so much. You're very Speaker 4 00:26:57 Welcome. Thank you, Tony so much for asking me to be a part of the Speaker 1 00:27:00 Well, that's it for the senior moves team this week. And thanks for joining us. If you've enjoyed the content, remember to subscribe and to share this episode on the app that you're using right now, your reviews and your comments, they really help us expand our reach as well as our perspective. So if you have time also drop us a note, let us know how we're doing for tips and tools, to clarify your parent project, simplify communication with your stakeholders and verify the professionals that you choose. You can find us on YouTube, follow us on Instagram and Facebook and join [email protected] Thanks again for trusting us until our next episode behold, and be helpful. Speaker 0 00:27:39 Thank you for listening to this senior moves podcast production to access our show notes, resources or forums go to senior moves.org. This show is for entertainment purposes only before making any decisions consult a professional. This show is copyrighted by Phoenician partners, LLC, and senior moves written permissions must be granted before syndication or rebroadcast.

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